+- vgZero (http://www.vgzero.com)
+-- Forum: Nintendo (/forum-117.html)
+--- Forum: Nintendo Wii U & 3DS (/forum-2.html)
+--- Thread: Why Nintendo will fail. (/thread-25310.html)
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - LemonManX - 06-08-2011 11:30 PM
I enjoyed the use of dropped stock for Nintendo's failure as a company. Can someone remind me if Sony's stock dropped when the PSN when belly up for a month?
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - MW7519 - 06-08-2011 11:59 PM
(06-08-2011 11:03 PM)GlueGun18 Wrote:(06-08-2011 10:23 PM)MW7519 Wrote: Yeah, you're right, the Wii U may be a great idea- except for the fact that it's going to offer slightly better tech than what we've had for the last 5 years, worse online play (which is almost guaranteed since the 3DS is still using freaking FRIEND CODES), and a controller that looks about as uncomfortable as it is large.
Lol.
The amount of fanboyism is astonishing. Nintendo could s*** in a box and people would still buy it. For all of their faults, Microsoft and Sony have delivered on everything that we've expected them to, and for the last 5 years Nintendo has done nothing but screw around- and you all are still willing to give them the benefit of the doubt? Thanks, but I'll put my faith into a company that actually deserves it.
http://www.vgzero.com/thread-25286.html
http://www.vgzero.com/thread-25266.html
http://www.vgzero.com/thread-25310.html
Duh, Winning!
Ummm....Buddy, what does that have to do with ANYTHING? Can I not be disatisfied with some aspect of each company? Or perhaps you're calling ME fanboy? In which case, I'd find that hard to understand, seeing as I own all 3 consoles and happen to s*** on all 3 of them quite a lot. I'm failing to see your point here.
Also, yet again you've turned harmless observations into some kind of fanboy war. I have news for you friend- I don't happen to think Microsoft or Sony are doing drastically better in certain areas, but what I do know is that they're both doing their best (particularly in Sony's case), and have given me a lot of enjoyment over the last 10 some-odd years. What about Nintendo? For the last 5, they've fucked me over and given me next to nothing.
Come back and speak further about this topic once you actually have some grasp on reality.
Anyways...
@Red: Why can I not accept it? LOL. There's a funny one. Gee, let's see, because Nintendo is using the equivalent of a competent computer from 2007 as its basis for a "hardcore gaming" machine in 2012? It's not a matter of accepting it friend, it's a matter of realizing it's complete BS. Nintendo will do what it's done for the last 5 years- release underwhelming technology in the interest of moolah.
I find it absolutely hilarious how I can ridicule both Sony and Microsoft, and then as soon as I DARE mention anything about Nintendo, people jump on me like a pack of wolves. Am I the only one who realizes that for the last 5 years, Nintendo has been screwing its customers? I guess so, because you all are some brainwashed mofos.
All I can say is- have fun with your Wii2. I'll be enjoying my Xbox 720 and PS4 while you plink away at your Hasbro iPad.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Red - 06-09-2011 12:05 AM
It probably has something to do with the fact that you hate Nintendo in multiple threads, all day long.
And by competent computer I assume you mean something that could max out games that came out that year, games like Crysis, which released in 2007 and as far as I know is still the best looking game released to date, 4 years later.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - MW7519 - 06-09-2011 12:19 AM
(06-09-2011 12:05 AM)Red Wrote: It probably has something to do with the fact that you hate Nintendo in multiple threads, all day long.
And by competent computer I assume you mean something that could max out games that came out that year, games like Crysis, which released in 2007 and as far as I know is still the best looking game released to date, 4 years later.
News flash: It's the biggest announcement of E3, and guess what? It's being discussed in about 50% of the threads. So I guess while everyone else is saying how interested in it they are, I shouldn't be able to say anything because I don't like it? Lol. Nice. Keep proving that you aren't mentally capable of processing anything that isn't related to "Nintendo" and "positivity".
And no, I don't actually. I mean a competent computer. IE: a very good one, but not necessarily the best. If you remember, in 2007 there was almost no rig in existence that could play Crysis 2 on max settings. Hell, even if this new console could, which I doubt it will, the new Sony/MS consoles will still blow it out of the water. Your argument is invalid.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - GlueGun18 - 06-09-2011 12:36 AM
My point is that you take everything at face value without doing a little research or putting things into perspective before trolling endlessly about it.
There are three logical reactions to the Wii U announcement, which was a brief demonstration on an incomplete product that is still in conceptual stages:
1. "I like what I saw, but I need to see a lot more before getting too excited."
2. "I didn't like what I saw, but I need to see a lot more before I write it off."
3. "I need to see a lot more before I can make any kind of judgement either way."
This was your reaction:
Going into every thread and accusing everyone who is interested in the Wii U of being a fanboy is not adding to the discussion and only diminishes the validity of your arguments.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Rooster - 06-09-2011 12:59 AM
(06-08-2011 11:59 PM)MW7519 Wrote: @Red: Why can I not accept it? LOL. There's a funny one. Gee, let's see, because Nintendo is using the equivalent of a competent computer from 2007 as its basis for a "hardcore gaming" machine in 2012? It's not a matter of accepting it friend, it's a matter of realizing it's complete BS.
Power7 is the LATEST Power Architecture from IBM. It's a 2010 chip, not a 2007.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - MW7519 - 06-09-2011 01:18 AM
(06-09-2011 12:36 AM)GlueGun18 Wrote: My point is that you take everything at face value without doing a little research or putting things into perspective before trolling endlessly about it.
There are three logical reactions to the Wii U announcement, which was a brief demonstration on an incomplete product that is still in conceptual stages:
1. "I like what I saw, but I need to see a lot more before getting too excited."
2. "I didn't like what I saw, but I need to see a lot more before I write it off."
3. "I need to see a lot more before I can make any kind of judgement either way."
This was your reaction:
Going into every thread and accusing everyone who is interested in the Wii U of being a fanboy is not adding to the discussion and only diminishes the validity of your arguments.
My reaction? Dude. All I said was that, while I generally like Nintendo, I see them heading down a very dangerous path, one which I presume will lead to huge financial troubles for them. Outside of that, I've posted my displeasure with Nintendo's said tactics in 3 or 4 threads. YOU are the one blowing things out of proportions.
Also, as for me not researching my claims? Are you seriously kidding me? All you've done this entire time is tell me how "fail" my arguments are, and you can't even provide any solid basis for your own. I've completely detailed, down to the smallest bit, my reasons for believing what I believe. You? You're blowing hot steam because somebody is showing displeasure with a console that you happpen to be having an orgasm over. Get real kid.
And lastly, how many threads have I gone into saying someone was a fanboy? I'm counting...This one, and perhaps one more where I said someone wasn't able to see past their love of Nintendo, or something like that.
You are seriously delusional. You make claims out of thin air- it's unbelievable. Until you put down the "Internet Tough Guy" act and stop pretending to be cool because you feel the need to post videos that you think somehow relate to your weakly-supported "arguments", you and I are not going to converse. I just simply won't respond to anything you say, or acknowledge you whatsoever.
@Rooster: Do I need to state this again? A: There's no confirmation that Nintendo is even using that chipset. B: By the time PS4/720 come out, don't you think they're going to be more powerful? Lol. Come on dude.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Rooster - 06-09-2011 02:20 AM
(06-09-2011 01:18 AM)MW7519 Wrote: @Rooster: Do I need to state this again? A: There's no confirmation that Nintendo is even using that chipset. B: By the time PS4/720 come out, don't you think they're going to be more powerful? Lol. Come on dude.
A: Here's the press release
Watson is built using Power7. Wii U has same processor technology as Watson. Therefore Wii U = Power7.
B: Power has absolutely nothing to do with anything at this point. Otherwise PS3/360 would be outselling Wii and PSP would be outselling DS. Nintendo has two barriers to get over in order to make Wii U a success:
- Online features
- 3rd Party support
As it is, Nintendo seems to be killing friend codes in favor of usernames which was one of their main problems. It seems that Nintendo is working on buffing their online feature set.
As for 3rd party support, Nintendo seems to have that as well with several developers expressing interest in developing for Wii U.
So really the only argument you have here is that Wii U won't be as powerful as the next Sony and Microsoft consoles which, according to this generation console sales, doesn't mean a damn thing.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - MW7519 - 06-09-2011 02:32 AM
(06-09-2011 02:20 AM)Rooster Wrote:(06-09-2011 01:18 AM)MW7519 Wrote: @Rooster: Do I need to state this again? A: There's no confirmation that Nintendo is even using that chipset. B: By the time PS4/720 come out, don't you think they're going to be more powerful? Lol. Come on dude.
A: Here's the press release
Watson is built using Power7. Wii U has same processor technology as Watson. Therefore Wii U = Power7.
B: Power has absolutely nothing to do with anything at this point. Otherwise PS3/360 would be outselling Wii and PSP would be outselling DS. Nintendo has two barriers to get over in order to make Wii U a success:
- Online features
- 3rd Party support
As it is, Nintendo seems to be killing friend codes in favor of usernames which was one of their main problems. It seems that Nintendo is working on buffing their online feature set.
As for 3rd party support, Nintendo seems to have that as well with several developers expressing interest in developing for Wii U.
So really the only argument you have here is that Wii U won't be as powerful as the next Sony and Microsoft consoles which, according to this generation console sales, doesn't mean a damn thing.
.....Yet again.... I repeat.... That is all still speculation.
Also, you say that my only argument is that, "the Wii U won't be as powerful as the next Sony and Microsoft consoles which, according to this generation console sales, doesn't mean a damn thing".
. . . . .
Wow, that's one of the biggest fail statements I've read so far. Yeah, sure, the Wii has sold the most- and guess what? It's also had the fewest quality games. So I'm glad you admit that Nintendo is in for yet another generation of shovelware- at least we agree on something. Oh, and by the way, if you haven't noticed- PS3 and 360 ARE outselling the Wii, by like a 2-1 ratio, but not because they just have better graphics- because they have real games.
Next, you tell me that there's already "Developer interest" in the Wii U? Wow, okay, like 6 or 7 big-name dev companies have shown interest in porting games over to a console that were already announced months ago. Yeah, they sound really interested to me....Lul. Bring this up again once the Wii U has mention of some decent third party exclusives. Otherwise, this is just Gamecube all over again.
Perhaps the funniest thing you say though, is that Nintendo is "buffing" their online featureset. Damn, congrats Nintendo, you are now almost on par with the online capabilities of a first generation Xbox. Oh- but wait, as far as I can tell, that little rumor hasn't even been confirmed, and even if it is, guess what? 3DS still uses friend codes, and they won't be go anywhere, so no matter what way you slice it, their online does suck and will suck.
Man, I love it when fanboys bring up arguments that they have no chance in hell of winning.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Rooster - 06-09-2011 02:51 AM
So even if they fix the Wii U online, the 3DS still has friend codes and therefore Wii U online sucks? Wow.
No that's not speculation. That was an official press release from IBM and Nintendo. Not speculation. Fact.
Speculation seems to work very well for your arguments, yet any speculation on my part is fail...
Anyway, I no longer care. Have fun with your next-gen Sony/Microsoft consoles. I'll have fun with my Wii U and next gen Sony/Microsoft stuff.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - MW7519 - 06-09-2011 02:59 AM
(06-09-2011 02:51 AM)Rooster Wrote: So even if they fix the Wii U online, the 3DS still has friend codes and therefore Wii U online sucks? Wow.
No that's not speculation. That was an official press release from IBM and Nintendo. Not speculation. Fact.
Speculation seems to work very well for your arguments, yet any speculation on my part is fail...
No, the point is that even IF the Wii U doesn't use friend codes, it's still going to be miles behind PSN and XBL, and since the 3DS still does use friend codes, not only does Nintendo's console's online architecture suck, their whole approach to online across all of their platforms suck.
Also, headlines don't mean jack- it's the fine print. The article even says that IBM did not explicitly say that Watson was the chipset being used. It was merely assumed- so no, not fact. And as I will reiterate, and apparently have to keep reiterating, it doesn't mean Jack because by 2013 whatever Nintendo uses is going to look like child's play compared to MS/Sony.
The difference my friend is that my speculations are based in reality, and yours are not. When I "speculate" that Wii's online service is going to suck, it's because their newest, $250 handheld already does, their Wii already does, and their DS already does- and since they aren't exactly known for their online prowess, it's a pretty solid bet their new Wii WILL suck. That's realistic speculation. Your speculation is essentially that "Hey, Nintendo is legit, so screw you, it's going to be awesome". Case and point.
I'm done with you. Your ever-shrinking posts are only a sign that you and every other Nintendophile here can't get over the fact that I merely suggested that the company might be going down the wrong path with the current state of their business model. Since you can't seem to handle that, nor provide reasonable evidence to the contrary, our argument is now concluded.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Rooster - 06-09-2011 03:14 AM
You're funny.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - LemonManX - 06-09-2011 03:21 AM
You know what's funny? It's like the shovelware devs are noticing the decline in interest in the Wii and thus are flooding Kinect and Move with that inane rubbish.
Listen, we know you feel very strongly that Nintendo have f***** all of this up, and that's fine. But there is no need for name-calling such as Nintendophile, etc.
I think the business model they are going for is the smartest one to go for. With the name they won't alienate their new audience and with the visuals, third party support they'll stand a chance at woo-ing the cores back (however they'll need to do this with original content, not lazy PS3/X360 ports) and with the new controller is a chance to show everyone some new innovation but at this point it is all purely speculation no matter what anyone believes or thinks might happen.
I will once again re-iterate that I doubt Sony/Microsoft will shift out new consoles because of the Wii U, unless it does really well. Thus who gives a crap if it won't be anything compared to Sony and Microsoft's next hypothetical consoles, they won't be as powerful as Nintendo's next hypothetical console which one be as powerful as Sony and Microsoft's next hypothetical console.
This is my final post in this now dead horse of a thread to simply state: feel free to judge the Wii U before it has shown the potential it could hold, but while you are being one of the most anti-Nintendo people I've ever met you will be welcome back when it proves you wrong.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Rooster - 06-09-2011 03:23 AM
[/thread]
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - MW7519 - 06-09-2011 04:01 AM
(06-09-2011 03:21 AM)LemonManX Wrote: You know what's funny? It's like the shovelware devs are noticing the decline in interest in the Wii and thus are flooding Kinect and Move with that inane rubbish.
Listen, we know you feel very strongly that Nintendo have f***** all of this up, and that's fine. But there is no need for name-calling such as Nintendophile, etc.
I think the business model they are going for is the smartest one to go for. With the name they won't alienate their new audience and with the visuals, third party support they'll stand a chance at woo-ing the cores back (however they'll need to do this with original content, not lazy PS3/X360 ports) and with the new controller is a chance to show everyone some new innovation but at this point it is all purely speculation no matter what anyone believes or thinks might happen.
I will once again re-iterate that I doubt Sony/Microsoft will shift out new consoles because of the Wii U, unless it does really well. Thus who gives a crap if it won't be anything compared to Sony and Microsoft's next hypothetical consoles, they won't be as powerful as Nintendo's next hypothetical console which one be as powerful as Sony and Microsoft's next hypothetical console.
This is my final post in this now dead horse of a thread to simply state: feel free to judge the Wii U before it has shown the potential it could hold, but while you are being one of the most anti-Nintendo people I've ever met you will be welcome back when it proves you wrong.
First let me say, I am once again pleased to see that unlike many here, you are of sound-enough mind to present a clean and solid argument in a respectful manner. Much appreciated.
However, I'll say a few things...
#1: How is Nintendophile name calling? I get called a douchebag, emotionally scarred, bitchy, whiny, etc. all in one thread, and because I label someone a Nintendophile, which means nothing more than "someone who is fanatic about Nintendo", I'm name calling? That doesn't make any sense to me.
#2: We'll just have to agree to disagree on that MS/Sony part, for reasons already stated.
#3: I am not an anti Nintendo person, I LOVE Nintendo. I'm an anti NEW Nintendo person. Look, you can say what you want, but to me, Nintendo is N64, Gamecube, etc. Wii ripped me off. It took my money, and delivered horrible online services, a bad control setup, and not nearly enough games. I put up with that for 5 years, and now, Nintendo seeks to do it all over again by forcing more gimmicks down my throat. You say that I should be more open minded about this console? No. I think I'm fine right where I am. Unlike everyone else on this board, I am not willing and ready to accept anything Nintendo throws at me because it has an N on the box. I want results, and unless I see serious, major results, I am going to be pissed about it all I want, because until that day, Nintendo has proven nothing to me. For those of you who are so willing to buy a Nintendo product after the epic-fail that is the Wii, I feel sorry for you.
And might I add, you also mentioned that the Nintendo community will welcome me back when I'm wrong. You accuse me of accusing the console unjustly, since it does not even exist? I accuse you of praising it before it deserves it. Nothing over the past few days has assured me, in any way, that I WILL be wrong. Stock prices drop, the fanbase is divided, 3DS has bombed thus far, and my own opinion is that Nintendo is flopping. I'd say I have a stronger stance here than any other.
Frankly, I just don't understand. For 5 years, they give you people an overclocked gamecube. For 25 years, they make the same games over and over. Now this year, they're doing the same thing, and you all have the audacity to put skepticism aside and label it the greatest thing since sliced bread? I call bulls***. Enjoy your "Baby's First Hardcore Console".
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Red - 06-09-2011 08:08 AM
I love how you talk about being in reality and then talk about S&M just using more advanced hardware that doesn't even exist.
And should I lock this since its nothing more than wall-of-text arguements?
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Pixel Zombie - 06-09-2011 08:16 AM
I'm not sure stocks should come into this at all when you consider the joystiq article said 'a low the company hasn't seen since before the launch of the original Wii'..i.e. just before Nintendo made millions.
And honestly I'm still in two minds about the WiiU, one part is excited about the possibles and Nintendo games in HD, while the other has a million unanswered questions and is extremely hesitant. I'm really looking forward to seeing what it can do, and if there will be a decent game selection for it..until then it seems down right silly to just write it off - especially when we know next to nothing right now.
Either way, this thing will sell (likely by the bucketload, especially at launch) and Nintendo will not go out of business or go third party. Even if the console didn't perform to expectations and they lost money, Nintendo have had under performing consoles before, and they haven't gone anywhere. Instead they just came back. And made like a squillion yen or something.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Jam - 06-09-2011 09:47 AM
(06-08-2011 10:36 PM)Rooster Wrote: The Power7 CPU is more powerful than the Cell Processor found in the PS3 and the Xenon processor found in the Xbox 360. Fact.
If the Wii U CPU is indeed based around the design of the Power7 then it will be at least 5-7x more powerful than the PS3 or 360. Adding a good GPU to avoid bottlenecking, the Wii U will be much, MUCH more than an 'overclocked PS3'.
Then isn't it a shame that the Wii U is getting ports of games developed for other consoles. Oh and you know the footage they showed at E3? That was the 360 and PS3 versions of the game and the Wii U versions are getting ported from them. The developers obviously see this and 360/PS3 on similar par. If this WAS a generational leap then Nintendo would have shown us the console and its capabilities, the fact they focused on the controller tells us that the controller is what differentiates it - not the console's power.
Quote:B: Power has absolutely nothing to do with anything at this point. Otherwise PS3/360 would be outselling Wii and PSP would be outselling DS. Nintendo has two barriers to get over in order to make Wii U a success:
Online features
3rd Party support
You broke your own argument in the same post! If online features and 3rd party support had anything to do at this point then the 360 and PS3 would be out selling the Wii. Seriously, think before you post.
And the fact of the matter is that graphics do matter on a gaming system, say all you want that they don't and how well some games can sell with pure graphics but at the end of the day things move forward and people want better presentation. Better graphics and over 'power' are an advantage of a system and should be noted.
--
And @Pixel_Zombie, the low before the Wii is totally logical and isn't relevant to the new low stock point following the reveal of the Wii U. The reason it is a 5 year low 'since before the launch of the Wii' is because of the Wii's huge success and that made the stock raise so much - it's not because it was low because the Wii was launching.
--
I'm going to let this thread continue to run, but please everyone be a bit more respectful when debating. Some things said have been a bit childish and I don't want it out of hand. Everyone be considerate of everyone else's points.
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - Rooster - 06-09-2011 06:40 PM
I probably should have said that I was talking about making Wii U a success with their own fanbase, not with everyone else. My bad.
As for the 360/PS3 footage being used at E3, I don't think that shows that 3rd parties believe this console to be on par with 360/PS3. I think we can all agree that Wii launch titles like Red Steel were nowhere near as graphical advanced as the Wii could get. The fact is, I don't really believe Nintendo was ready to show what Wii U was and just let some news out at E3 to quell some of the rumors floating around the Internet about it. Development on those ports to Wii U probably hasn't even begun yet or they would've shown more footage of what the console was truly capable of. Nintendo clearly wasn't ready and we're seeing that they're still working on how many of the new controller are going to be usable on each console which shows me that R&D isn't even complete yet on Wii U so how could we possibly gauge its graphical prowess?
Mostly I think I was looking at numbers when it comes to the Wii CPU which IS a huge jump ahead of what PS3 and 360 are capable of (assuming of course that the chipset is on par with the lowest Power7 set). Just wait until next E3 and we'll see what Nintendo can cook up with all the new power. Hopefully I'm not completely wrong about this but hey I'm human so it's been known to happen
RE: Why Nintendo will fail. - AliceFeatherson - 06-26-2011 05:24 AM
Wii U is coming, guys. I'll read and more fully respond once my excitement settles down a bit.
Have a look at the presser and then see how you guys feel.